You might say in your clues to seek letterboxes during daytime hours.
List the hours the cemetery is open in the clues

Most cemetery maintenance goes on during the week days.
You might want to avoid those days.

If anyone asks what you are doing you can say research.
Take a camera with you also...

I think the authorities are over reacting.

John










[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I would put any information you want the letterbox hunter to know about
checking the box in this cemetery with the clues. Not in the box.

STAR:W+S=DRR































**************************************
See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I was pestered by a small town slob police chief in Coalton cemetery while looking for a box. He said he had trouble with folks and those GPS things. I had a camera and was "looking for relatives."
It's always cemetery mowing day whenever I visit boxes in Indiana, they seem to be in about half of the cemeteries I search over there.

-----Original Message-----
From: baliddle@sbcglobal.net
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, 23 Apr 2007 7:28 PM
Subject: [LbNA] question about planting/warnings

I have a question about planting. I'm in process of planting a
series of boxes in local cemeteries. There's a cemetery that I want
to use that I think would be perfect. But, a friend of mine is a
county deputy sheriff and one of her co-deps told her that they often
bust people in there for various delinquent activities (drugs,
etc). I've been through there several times in the past few weeks
and have never seen anyone in there, much less people doing these
things. This isn't a highly dangerous/super high crime area. I
think if people go there during the day and use common sense, they
would be safe enough in there. It may not be a great idea to go a
night (I'm not sure if they lock the gates at night here like most seem to do).

I have a very specific idea of the kind of cemetery I'm looking for
and I'm having a much harder time finding planting sites than I
thought I would. This one is perfect in all other aspects , so I
really want to plant a box in there.

My question is, should I:
- not plant it there at all because of this reported activity
- plant it anyway and don't mention anything about it.
- put some kind of vague reminder in the box clues about being extra
careful while there
- put some kind of more specific suggestion about not going at
night/bring a friend with you
- put some kind of really specific warning about possible delinquent
activity and not to stop if there are other people around

What would you do?

Bali


________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dearest Bali,

It may be exegetic to peruse the archives re cemetery boxes. There has
been considerable debate/beating of dead horses pertaining to the
propriety and propensity of and for planting in cemeteries
(letterboxes not the dead).

Lady Prisspott

Thanks for the reply, Lady Prisspott. My question really isn't about whether or not I should plant a box in a cemetery. I don't want to get into that issue. What I'm really looking for is advice on whether I should plant a box in an area were there may or may not be the potential for run-ins with criminal activity. I've never seen anything shady there, but have heard if happenings. I just want to know if I should let people know to be extra cautious, not plant there at all or plant and leave them to their own common sense.

So, I'm revising my question...
Would you plant a box ANYWHERE where there may be a potentially dangerous enviornment? And if you would, would you put a an additional "be safe" type warning in your clues, or not mention it and assume people read the disclaimers and warnings posted on LBNA/AQ?

Thanks,
Bali

Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee Hedge wrote:
Dearest Bali,

It may be exegetic to peruse the archives re cemetery boxes. There has
been considerable debate/beating of dead horses pertaining to the
propriety and propensity of and for planting in cemeteries
(letterboxes not the dead).

Lady Prisspott






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 4/24/07, Baliddle wrote:

What I'm really looking for is advice on whether I should plant a box in an
area were there may or may not be the potential for run-ins with criminal
activity. I've never seen anything shady there, but have heard if
happenings. I just want to know if I should let people know to be extra
cautious, not plant there at all or plant and leave them to their own common
sense.
*********************************************

Here's how I see it:

Anytime we as boxers go after a box, we are left to our own common sense;
HOWEVER, if the placer knows something about a location that should be told,
they have a responsibility to tell it.

When we are out boxing, things change and we have to evaluate the situation
on a given day. As an example, a box that might be perfectly safe on a dry
day may be dangerous to reach on a rainy day when the nearby creek is
rising. A finder can't expect the placer to tell EVERYTHING that might
possibly happen, so we have to keep our own eyes open.

I have two boxes that come to my mind in terms of including warnings for
finders. Both are great locations and somewhere I wanted to take the
finder. One of them is definitely a daytime box only though, and I mention
that in my clues. Another is placed in an area where there are known to be
alligators so I caution the finder about small animals and children near the
water. In either of these places, the risk is not immediately recognizable,
but it is there and I don't want my box to be the reason someone's family
pet gets chomped up for alligator appetizer.

I wouldn't worry about mentioning standard hazards though, or highly
unlikely risks. As an example, warning finders about poison ivy near boxes
in Texas is like telling someone not to dive headfirst into shallow water.
If the finder doesn't have the common sense to know that anytime you aren't
standing on concrete in Texas in the summertime you are very likely standing
near PI, then maybe a good case of itch will solve that problem.

If the risk you are aware of is not immediately recognizable, you should
probably mention it. We all appreciate a heads-up, but none of us needs a
mother - I hit the trail to get away from mine (j/k Mom!).

--
Barefoot Lucy
"It's not about footwear, it's about philosophy"


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dearest Bali,

What I hear you saying is that, regardless of any opinions that have
been expressed about the impropriety of planting a letterbox on
private, hallowed ground, you intend to plant there and your only
concern is safety of those seeking the box. Given your determination
to plant would the opinion that the safety concerns should preclude
you from planting there sway you?

It seems axiomatic that if there's enough concern to ask other's
opinion that you would simply choose another spot. With 196,940,400
square miles of land surface on Earth I think there are plenty of
other places (excluding Connecticut of course) to plant; or are you
asking for validation of your a priori decision to plant in this
particular cemetery?

Lady Prisspott

I just love it when her Ladyship uses those high brow words!

Mark

-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee Hedge"
or are you asking for validation of your a priori decision to plant in this
particular cemetery?

Lady Prisspott

|.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

de gustibus non est disputandum


--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, mjpepe1@... wrote:
>
> I just love it when her Ladyship uses those high brow words!
>
> Mark

Lady Prisspott,

You seem to have read a lot more into my email than I actually
wrote. I asked a very general question that had actually nothing to
do with the plant site being a cemetery: "If there was a potential
danger in a potential plant site, would you plant or not plant? And
if you'd plant, would you add a warning?" The danger could be
anything from delinquents, alligators, steep one-way only roads,
raging rapids or a bee nest. The potential plant site could be a
cemetery, state park, my back yard or the moon. None of those
variables are particularly relevant to the question at hand.

I never listed my whole catalog of needs, concerns or requirements of
a specific plant site. In actuality, I do not think or believe that
this place is overly dangerous or hazardous. I do not believe that
there is any more danger at this particular place than there would be
at any other random site in this area. If I had, I would have
dismissed it out of hand and moved on to the next. I only asked this
general question because I heard tell of activity which may put
someone in a bad situation if they came across it. I have never
witnessed and did not see any evidence of this activity during the
times I've been there. I don't think it's likely people will run
into any problems while there, but I wondered if I should make a
point of mentioning it, in order to err on the side of caution. I
was merely asking for some friendly advice on this one small aspect
from some seasoned veterans.

I was not seeking validation or approval to plant this box in this
site. And I don't believe I am overly determined to plant at this
specific place. I would like to plant here, because although there
may be 196,940,400 square miles of land on the earth, there are only
about 10 square miles of actual land that are available to me that
meet my requirements (and that estimate is exceedingly generous, I believe).

As I said before, I do not desire to open the whole cemetery debate
again. As it happens, this is NOT a privately owned piece of
land. I wouldn't plant on private-owned property without out
permission. As I gather from your email, you seem to have a
deep-felt negative opinion of 'boxing in cemeteries regardless of any
other circumstances. That is certainly your prerogative and I can
respect that. If you find it disrespectful to the deceased or to be
a desecration of the land, there's no reason you have to plant or
seek boxes in cemeteries. But, not everyone will hold the same
opinion. Hopefully, you can respect that. I think that visiting
cemeteries is very interesting and educational. I think it's a
wonderful way to remember our past, honor and remember our ancestors,
even if they are people we've never met. My intent with this series
is only to share my interest in this regard with other people. I do
not believe that I'm dishonoring, disturbing or destroying any of the
cemeteries or people buried in them with this endeavor. That said,
I'm sure there are other people that will feel it's improper and will
not visit the boxes. I'm also sure that I will manage to live
happily ever after without having their stamp in my log book.

Bali


At 01:13 PM 4/25/2007, you wrote:

>Dearest Bali,
>
>What I hear you saying is that, regardless of any opinions that have
>been expressed about the impropriety of planting a letterbox on
>private, hallowed ground, you intend to plant there and your only
>concern is safety of those seeking the box. Given your determination
>to plant would the opinion that the safety concerns should preclude
>you from planting there sway you?
>
>It seems axiomatic that if there's enough concern to ask other's
>opinion that you would simply choose another spot. With 196,940,400
>square miles of land surface on Earth I think there are plenty of
>other places (excluding Connecticut of course) to plant; or are you
>asking for validation of your a priori decision to plant in this
>particular cemetery?
>
>Lady Prisspott



Beth

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I love cemeteries, and boxing in them. My daughters (11, 9, and 4) and I
went to find a box in one this past weekend. It was a huge old cemetery.
The girls asked lots of questions about the stones and were amazed by
the size, color, shapes, names, etc... We have a little family cemetery
and that is the only one the girls had been in before. They were
'scared' at first, walking around the 'dead people', but after a few
minutes they were over that and they have a new 'view' of, and respect
for, cemeteries. To me visiting a cemetery is like visiting a museum or
art gallery, except you get history, art, AND get to be in the beautiful
outdoors. :)

-Lisa (of the HowD girls)


-----Original Message-----
From: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of baliddle
Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 10:41 PM
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [LbNA] Re: question about planting/warnings



Lady Prisspott,

You seem to have read a lot more into my email than I actually
wrote. I asked a very general question that had actually nothing to
do with the plant site being a cemetery: "If there was a potential
danger in a potential plant site, would you plant or not plant? And
if you'd plant, would you add a warning?" The danger could be
anything from delinquents, alligators, steep one-way only roads,
raging rapids or a bee nest. The potential plant site could be a
cemetery, state park, my back yard or the moon. None of those
variables are particularly relevant to the question at hand.

I never listed my whole catalog of needs, concerns or requirements of
a specific plant site. In actuality, I do not think or believe that
this place is overly dangerous or hazardous. I do not believe that
there is any more danger at this particular place than there would be
at any other random site in this area. If I had, I would have
dismissed it out of hand and moved on to the next. I only asked this
general question because I heard tell of activity which may put
someone in a bad situation if they came across it. I have never
witnessed and did not see any evidence of this activity during the
times I've been there. I don't think it's likely people will run
into any problems while there, but I wondered if I should make a
point of mentioning it, in order to err on the side of caution. I
was merely asking for some friendly advice on this one small aspect
from some seasoned veterans.

I was not seeking validation or approval to plant this box in this
site. And I don't believe I am overly determined to plant at this
specific place. I would like to plant here, because although there
may be 196,940,400 square miles of land on the earth, there are only
about 10 square miles of actual land that are available to me that
meet my requirements (and that estimate is exceedingly generous, I
believe).

As I said before, I do not desire to open the whole cemetery debate
again. As it happens, this is NOT a privately owned piece of
land. I wouldn't plant on private-owned property without out
permission. As I gather from your email, you seem to have a
deep-felt negative opinion of 'boxing in cemeteries regardless of any
other circumstances. That is certainly your prerogative and I can
respect that. If you find it disrespectful to the deceased or to be
a desecration of the land, there's no reason you have to plant or
seek boxes in cemeteries. But, not everyone will hold the same
opinion. Hopefully, you can respect that. I think that visiting
cemeteries is very interesting and educational. I think it's a
wonderful way to remember our past, honor and remember our ancestors,
even if they are people we've never met. My intent with this series
is only to share my interest in this regard with other people. I do
not believe that I'm dishonoring, disturbing or destroying any of the
cemeteries or people buried in them with this endeavor. That said,
I'm sure there are other people that will feel it's improper and will
not visit the boxes. I'm also sure that I will manage to live
happily ever after without having their stamp in my log book.

Bali

At 01:13 PM 4/25/2007, you wrote:

>Dearest Bali,
>
>What I hear you saying is that, regardless of any opinions that have
>been expressed about the impropriety of planting a letterbox on
>private, hallowed ground, you intend to plant there and your only
>concern is safety of those seeking the box. Given your determination
>to plant would the opinion that the safety concerns should preclude
>you from planting there sway you?
>
>It seems axiomatic that if there's enough concern to ask other's
>opinion that you would simply choose another spot. With 196,940,400
>square miles of land surface on Earth I think there are plenty of
>other places (excluding Connecticut of course) to plant; or are you
>asking for validation of your a priori decision to plant in this
>particular cemetery?
>
>Lady Prisspott

Beth

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well said!

I hope that you plant your series. From your previous email, I don't think it would be necessary to attach a warning.

Happy letterboxing,
Howling Coyote


baliddle wrote:
Lady Prisspott,

You seem to have read a lot more into my email than I actually
wrote. I asked a very general question that had actually nothing to
do with the plant site being a cemetery: "If there was a potential
danger in a potential plant site, would you plant or not plant? And
if you'd plant, would you add a warning?" The danger could be
anything from delinquents, alligators, steep one-way only roads,
raging rapids or a bee nest. The potential plant site could be a
cemetery, state park, my back yard or the moon. None of those
variables are particularly relevant to the question at hand.

I never listed my whole catalog of needs, concerns or requirements of
a specific plant site. In actuality, I do not think or believe that
this place is overly dangerous or hazardous. I do not believe that
there is any more danger at this particular place than there would be
at any other random site in this area. If I had, I would have
dismissed it out of hand and moved on to the next. I only asked this
general question because I heard tell of activity which may put
someone in a bad situation if they came across it. I have never
witnessed and did not see any evidence of this activity during the
times I've been there. I don't think it's likely people will run
into any problems while there, but I wondered if I should make a
point of mentioning it, in order to err on the side of caution. I
was merely asking for some friendly advice on this one small aspect
from some seasoned veterans.

I was not seeking validation or approval to plant this box in this
site. And I don't believe I am overly determined to plant at this
specific place. I would like to plant here, because although there
may be 196,940,400 square miles of land on the earth, there are only
about 10 square miles of actual land that are available to me that
meet my requirements (and that estimate is exceedingly generous, I believe).

As I said before, I do not desire to open the whole cemetery debate
again. As it happens, this is NOT a privately owned piece of
land. I wouldn't plant on private-owned property without out
permission. As I gather from your email, you seem to have a
deep-felt negative opinion of 'boxing in cemeteries regardless of any
other circumstances. That is certainly your prerogative and I can
respect that. If you find it disrespectful to the deceased or to be
a desecration of the land, there's no reason you have to plant or
seek boxes in cemeteries. But, not everyone will hold the same
opinion. Hopefully, you can respect that. I think that visiting
cemeteries is very interesting and educational. I think it's a
wonderful way to remember our past, honor and remember our ancestors,
even if they are people we've never met. My intent with this series
is only to share my interest in this regard with other people. I do
not believe that I'm dishonoring, disturbing or destroying any of the
cemeteries or people buried in them with this endeavor. That said,
I'm sure there are other people that will feel it's improper and will
not visit the boxes. I'm also sure that I will manage to live
happily ever after without having their stamp in my log book.

Bali


At 01:13 PM 4/25/2007, you wrote:

>Dearest Bali,
>
>What I hear you saying is that, regardless of any opinions that have
>been expressed about the impropriety of planting a letterbox on
>private, hallowed ground, you intend to plant there and your only
>concern is safety of those seeking the box. Given your determination
>to plant would the opinion that the safety concerns should preclude
>you from planting there sway you?
>
>It seems axiomatic that if there's enough concern to ask other's
>opinion that you would simply choose another spot. With 196,940,400
>square miles of land surface on Earth I think there are plenty of
>other places (excluding Connecticut of course) to plant; or are you
>asking for validation of your a priori decision to plant in this
>particular cemetery?
>
>Lady Prisspott



Beth

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dearest Bali,

As it happens Her Ladyship is merely puzzled by the fascination with
planting in cemeteries. While her Ladyship finds the study of history
fascinating her Ladyship doesn't find a need to combine it with
letterboxing. It is also the case that some find cemeteries to be
places where one's conduct should honor the memory of those interred.
It's easy to see how these persons could find the exercise of what
they would probably construe as a frivolous hobby to be disrespectful
when carried out on consecrated ground. Considering these two facts
leads her Ladyship to conclude; "why bother"? Coming from this point
of view and considering your concerns about safety it simply seems
illogical to insist on planting in this cemetery but I have no
delusions of being the letterboxing police, you obviously will
exercise your own reasoning and do as you see fit.

Her Ladyship is also frustrated with the infantilization of American
society and the development of the "Nanny State". The American public
seems to feel that it is a duty of the State to protect us from, and
indemnify us against, all harm. We have become children who expect the
State to act as our constant protector leading to a diffusion of
responsibility for our own actions and choices outward and ultimately
to the State. Your question seems an example of this. You state that
your concern is based on hearsay yet you seem to sense that you will
be held responsible if an autonomous adult engaged in the exercise of
free will enters, of their own volition, a situation which could be
dangerous. This notion is apparently so inculcated that you are
concerned merely on the suggestion of risk, not even on the first hand
observation of dangerous activity at the subject location. Americans
needs to grow up and realize that being an adult with a free will
carries risks and though this may seem unpleasant or unfair that the
blessings of liberty and free choice are far greater than the slight
risks we must accept. Of course there is always someone ready with an
anecdote about some one who was injured through some one else's
negligence as if one incidence should absolve each and every
individual of responsibility for their choices. It's the same
reasoning that fills states coffers with cash from lotteries. "Someone
has to win" the rationale goes. This is woefully wrong. Someone
eventually wins when the numbers of people playing reaches the level
of the odds. If a billion tickets are sold then it is statistically
probable that at least one person will have their numbers drawn
despite the billion to one odds that their specific set of numbers
will be drawn. Equivalently, one negative outcome of the exercise of
choice out of the inestimably large number of choices that the
billions of people on the planet make every day does not constitute
evidence of impending doom for anyone who dares to make a choice.
Given that you have no first hand knowledge of risk her Ladyship would
say let adults act like adults who should be capable of deciding for
them selves if they should avoid said cemetery and stop enabling the
further infantilization of the American public.

This second frustration also leads to a why bother attitude which may
have lead to her Ladyship's reply sounding more curt than was needed.
Her Ladyship gathers that dearest Bali didn't bargain on this rant
either so her Ladyship shall untwist her knickers and you go frolic
among some graves.

LP

well said..at least I think.

Wow, what a use of the English language, Misses P...by far one of more entertaining reads in some time.

Hope to see you again at the Pub Crawl

Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee Hedge wrote:
Dearest Bali,

As it happens Her Ladyship is merely puzzled by the fascination with
planting in cemeteries. While her Ladyship finds the study of history
fascinating her Ladyship doesn't find a need to combine it with
letterboxing. It is also the case that some find cemeteries to be
places where one's conduct should honor the memory of those interred.
It's easy to see how these persons could find the exercise of what
they would probably construe as a frivolous hobby to be disrespectful
when carried out on consecrated ground. Considering these two facts
leads her Ladyship to conclude; "why bother"? Coming from this point
of view and considering your concerns about safety it simply seems
illogical to insist on planting in this cemetery but I have no
delusions of being the letterboxing police, you obviously will
exercise your own reasoning and do as you see fit.

Her Ladyship is also frustrated with the infantilization of American
society and the development of the "Nanny State". The American public
seems to feel that it is a duty of the State to protect us from, and
indemnify us against, all harm. We have become children who expect the
State to act as our constant protector leading to a diffusion of
responsibility for our own actions and choices outward and ultimately
to the State. Your question seems an example of this. You state that
your concern is based on hearsay yet you seem to sense that you will
be held responsible if an autonomous adult engaged in the exercise of
free will enters, of their own volition, a situation which could be
dangerous. This notion is apparently so inculcated that you are
concerned merely on the suggestion of risk, not even on the first hand
observation of dangerous activity at the subject location. Americans
needs to grow up and realize that being an adult with a free will
carries risks and though this may seem unpleasant or unfair that the
blessings of liberty and free choice are far greater than the slight
risks we must accept. Of course there is always someone ready with an
anecdote about some one who was injured through some one else's
negligence as if one incidence should absolve each and every
individual of responsibility for their choices. It's the same
reasoning that fills states coffers with cash from lotteries. "Someone
has to win" the rationale goes. This is woefully wrong. Someone
eventually wins when the numbers of people playing reaches the level
of the odds. If a billion tickets are sold then it is statistically
probable that at least one person will have their numbers drawn
despite the billion to one odds that their specific set of numbers
will be drawn. Equivalently, one negative outcome of the exercise of
choice out of the inestimably large number of choices that the
billions of people on the planet make every day does not constitute
evidence of impending doom for anyone who dares to make a choice.
Given that you have no first hand knowledge of risk her Ladyship would
say let adults act like adults who should be capable of deciding for
them selves if they should avoid said cemetery and stop enabling the
further infantilization of the American public.

This second frustration also leads to a why bother attitude which may
have lead to her Ladyship's reply sounding more curt than was needed.
Her Ladyship gathers that dearest Bali didn't bargain on this rant
either so her Ladyship shall untwist her knickers and you go frolic
among some graves.

LP






"Its not about finding the box, but finding the location the box has taken you too."

---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dearest Lady Prisspott,

Your letter made me smile. It was a rant that I wish more would read
and understand. Thankyou and very well said! This is one of my
favorites: "Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a
little security will deserve neither and lose both." -- Benjamin
Franklin

The Spooky Group



--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Lady Hydrangea Prisspott nee
Hedge" wrote:
>
> Her Ladyship is also frustrated with the infantilization of American
> society and the development of the "Nanny State". The American
public
> seems to feel that it is a duty of the State to protect us from, and
> indemnify us against, all harm. We have become children who expect
the
> State to act as our constant protector leading to a diffusion of
> responsibility for our own actions and choices outward and
ultimately
> to the State. Your question seems an example of this. You state that
> your concern is based on hearsay yet you seem to sense that you will
> be held responsible if an autonomous adult engaged in the exercise
of
> free will enters, of their own volition, a situation which could be
> dangerous. This notion is apparently so inculcated that you are
> concerned merely on the suggestion of risk, not even on the first
hand
> observation of dangerous activity at the subject location. Americans
> needs to grow up and realize that being an adult with a free will
> carries risks and though this may seem unpleasant or unfair that the
> blessings of liberty and free choice are far greater than the slight
> risks we must accept. Of course there is always someone ready with
an
> anecdote about some one who was injured through some one else's
> negligence as if one incidence should absolve each and every
> individual of responsibility for their choices. It's the same
> reasoning that fills states coffers with cash from
lotteries. "Someone
> has to win" the rationale goes. This is woefully wrong. Someone
> eventually wins when the numbers of people playing reaches the level
> of the odds. If a billion tickets are sold then it is statistically
> probable that at least one person will have their numbers drawn
> despite the billion to one odds that their specific set of numbers
> will be drawn. Equivalently, one negative outcome of the exercise of
> choice out of the inestimably large number of choices that the
> billions of people on the planet make every day does not constitute
> evidence of impending doom for anyone who dares to make a choice.
> Given that you have no first hand knowledge of risk her Ladyship
would
> say let adults act like adults who should be capable of deciding for
> them selves if they should avoid said cemetery and stop enabling the
> further infantilization of the American public.
>
> This second frustration also leads to a why bother attitude which
may
> have lead to her Ladyship's reply sounding more curt than was
needed.
> Her Ladyship gathers that dearest Bali didn't bargain on this rant
> either so her Ladyship shall untwist her knickers and you go frolic
> among some graves.
>
> LP
>